![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 10-06-2010 05:11 PM (13 years ago)  (m) @ inemx, can you prove it that Jesus christ ( may the peace of Allah be upon him) is the son of God and where in the Holy Bible does he call himself a son of God? I will be glad if you can prove it clearly. But we (muslims can prove that Jesus was a prophet like other prophets before him
FROM THE STORY YOU MUST HAVE HEARD OR READ, JESUS WAS ARRESTED BY SOLDIERS, LED BY JEWISH RELIGION LEADERS, WAS CONDENMED BY PONTIUS PILATE AND CRUCIFIED. THAT IS HISTORY. THE QUESTION IS: WHY WAS HE EVEN ARRESTED, CONDENMED AND HANGED ON THE CROSS? WHAT WERE THE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST HIM? THAT HE DIDN'T CONFORM TO THEIR RELIGIOUS TRADITION- YOU WOULD SAY... YES OR NO. JOHN 5;18 SAYS, ''the jews sought all more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.'' YOU SEE? HE WAS ACCUSED OF BREAKING A TRADITION. BUT MORE THAN THAT, HE CLAIMED DEITY. AGAIN IN JOHN 10:30-39, THE LORD SAID, '' I and My Father are one.'' Then the jews took up stones again tO stone Him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shown you from My Father. For which of those works do ye stone Me'' The Jews answered Him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou being man, maketh thyself God'' ...If Ido not do the works of My Father, believe Me not, but if i do, though you do not believe me that the father is in me, and I in Him''. Therefore they sought again to arrest him, but He escaped out of their hand. SO, YOU SEE THAT JESUS ACTUALLY CALLED HIMSELF THE SON OF GOD, NOT ONCE, NOT TWICE. AND THAT WAS THE MAJOR REASON WHY THE RELIGIOUS PEOPLE OF HIS DAYS WERE SEEKING TO KILL HIM. THERE WAS NO SINGLE CRIME OF WHICH THEY CONVICT HIM, BUT OF WHAT THEY REGARDED AS BLASPHEMY. AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THIS IS THE SAME PROBLEM MUSLIMS HAVE WITH CHRISTIANITY- BECAUSE WE BELIEVE IN WHAT JESUS SAYS HE IS. YOU SEE, IF JESUS WERE TO BE HERE TODAY, DO YOU REALISE HE MIGHT HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS WITH ISLAMIC LEADERS AS HE HAD WITH THE PHARISEES OF HIS DAYS? [/color]
It is not wise to follow religion blindly becuase you found your parents in Christianity or Islam. Me as a person i have done my research and i thank God for guiding me to the truth.
Between Paul and Jesus who was the sent one? of course everybody will say its Christ and that is the more reason why we must pay heed to the message he was trying to pass which is to Keep God's commandments.
Most of you would remember the American historical researcher and mathematician, Michael H. Hart who published a book : "THE 100, THE TOP HUNDRED OR THE GREATEST HUNDRED IN HISTORY." In his book he gives the names of the 100 "Most Influential Men in History" and his reasons for their positions in his list. Amazingly, he (most probably a Christian) puts Muhummed (peace be upon him) FIRST1 in his hundred, and with good reasons too. And with equally good reasons he places Jesus Christ (peace be upon him), the man accepted as "Lord" and "Saviour" by nearly all his fellow Americans, number THREE.
Though there are at the moment 200 million more nominal Christians in the world than the 1000 million Muslims, Mr. Hart divides the credit for founding Christianity between Paul and Jesus, and he gives the greater portion to Paul. Hence the 3rd position for Jesus. Every knowledgeable Christian concedes that the real founder of Christianity is St. Paul and not Jesus Christ (peace be upon him).
In any event, if there is any division between a Muslim and a Christian on the grounds of dogma, belief, ethics or morality, then the cause of such conflict could be traced to an utterance of Paul found in his books of Corinthians, Phillipians, Galatians, Thessolanians, etc., in the Bible.
As against the teaching of the Master (Jesus) that salvation only comes through keeping of the commandments (Mathew 19:16-17), Paul nails the law and the commandments to the cross Paul nails the law and the commandments to the cross (Colossians 2:14) 1 and claims that salvation can only be obtained through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ:-
"If Christ be not risen from the dead, then our preaching is vain, and your faith is also vain."
(1 Corinthians 15:14)
According to St. Paul, there is nothing that Christianity can offer mankind, other than the blood and gore of Jesus. If Jesus did NOT die, and he was NOT resurrected from the dead, then there can be NO salvation in Christianity! "For all your good deeds", says the Christian dogmatist, "are like filthy rags" — (Isaiah 64:6).
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 10-06-2010 05:11 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 10-06-2010 05:23 PM (13 years ago) (m) @ inemx, can you prove it that Jesus christ ( may the peace of Allah be upon him) is the son of God and where in the Holy Bible does he call himself a son of God? I will be glad if you can prove it clearly. But we (muslims can prove that Jesus was a prophet like other prophets before him
FROM THE STORY YOU MUST HAVE HEARD OR READ, JESUS WAS ARRESTED BY SOLDIERS, LED BY JEWISH RELIGION LEADERS, WAS CONDENMED BY PONTIUS PILATE AND CRUCIFIED. THAT IS HISTORY. THE QUESTION IS: WHY WAS HE EVEN ARRESTED, CONDENMED AND HANGED ON THE CROSS? WHAT WERE THE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST HIM? THAT HE DIDN'T CONFORM TO THEIR RELIGIOUS TRADITION- YOU WOULD SAY... YES OR NO. JOHN 5;18 SAYS, ''the jews sought all more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.'' YOU SEE? HE WAS ACCUSED OF BREAKING A TRADITION. BUT MORE THAN THAT, HE CLAIMED DEITY. AGAIN IN JOHN 10:30-39, THE LORD SAID, '' I and My Father are one.'' Then the jews took up stones again tO stone Him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shown you from My Father. For which of those works do ye stone Me'' The Jews answered Him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou being man, maketh thyself God'' ...If Ido not do the works of My Father, believe Me not, but if i do, though you do not believe me that the father is in me, and I in Him''. Therefore they sought again to arrest him, but He escaped out of their hand. SO, YOU SEE THAT JESUS ACTUALLY CALLED HIMSELF THE SON OF GOD, NOT ONCE, NOT TWICE. AND THAT WAS THE MAJOR REASON WHY THE RELIGIOUS PEOPLE OF HIS DAYS WERE SEEKING TO KILL HIM. THERE WAS NO SINGLE CRIME OF WHICH THEY CONVICT HIM, BUT OF WHAT THEY REGARDED AS BLASPHEMY. AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THIS IS THE SAME PROBLEM MUSLIMS HAVE WITH CHRISTIANITY- BECAUSE WE BELIEVE IN WHAT JESUS SAYS HE IS. YOU SEE, IF JESUS WERE TO BE HERE TODAY, DO YOU REALISE HE MIGHT HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS WITH ISLAMIC LEADERS AS HE HAD WITH THE PHARISEES OF HIS DAYS? [/color]
"THE DEATH OF JESUS ON THE CROSS IS THE CENTRE OF ALL CHRISTIAN THEOLOGY. . . ALL CHRISTIAN STATEMENTS ABOUT GOD, ABOUT CREATION, ABOUT SIN AND DEATH HAVE THEIR FOCAL POINT IN THE CRUCIFIED CHRIST. ALL CHRISTIAN STATEMENTS ABOUT HISTORY, ABOUT THE CHURCH, ABOUT FAITH AND SANCTIFICATION, ABOUT THE FUTURE AND ABOUT HOPE STEM FROM THE CRUCIFIED CHRIST", Professor Jurgen Moltmann in his — "The Crucified God"
In a nutshell. No CrucifixionI — No Christianity! This is the experience of us Muslims, in this ocean of Christianity, which is Nigeria. A thousand sects and denominations of Christianity are vying with one another to redeem the "heathen" (as they say) from hell-fire.
However, in this battle no Christian priest, parson or predikant, or hot-gospeller, local or imported, will ever endeavour to teach the Muslim something about hygiene; for we Muslims can claim to be the most hygienic people (I am talking about personal hygiene).
Nor do they endeavour to teach us about hospitality; for we are the most hospitable of people. Nor about ethics or morality; for we are the most moral people — (as a whole) i.e. we don't drink, we don't gamble, we don’t date, court or dance; we pray 5 times a day, we fast for one whole month during the Muslim Holy month of Ramadaan; and we take pleasure in being a charitable people.
Despite any of our shortcomings, we venture to suggest that there is not another group of people that can "show a candle" to us in brotherhood, in piety or in sobriety.
Most Christians would always say "but you do not have salvation." Because salvation comes "only through the blood of the lord Jesus". "All your good works are like filthy rags", theysay. "If only you Muslims would accept the redeeming blood of Jesus, and take Jesus as your 'Personal Saviour', you Muslims, then would be like angels walking the earth."
What are we Muslims to say to this Christian claim? Nothing better than Allah's shattering reply to the Jewish boast!.
“And because of their saying (in boast), “We killed Messiah ‘Isa (Jesus), son of Maryam(Mary), the Messenger of Allah,” – but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of Isa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge , they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e ‘Isa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary) pbuh];” The Holy Qur'an, Chapter 4, Verse 157
Allah(God) made it clear, Jesus (pbuh) was neither killed nor crucified, Had the Christians accepted the Holy Quran as the Word of God, the problem of the crucifixion would never have arisen. They vehemently oppose the Quranic teaching and attack everything Islamic. In the words of Thomas Carlyle — "THEY (the Christians) HAVE BEEN TRAINED TO HATE THE MAN MOHAMED AND HIS RELIGION.
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 10-06-2010 05:23 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 10-06-2010 05:30 PM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD? | Posted: at 10-06-2010 05:30 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 10-06-2010 05:37 PM (13 years ago) (m) @ inemx, can you prove it that Jesus christ ( may the peace of Allah be upon him) is the son of God and where in the Holy Bible does he call himself a son of God? I will be glad if you can prove it clearly. But we (muslims can prove that Jesus was a prophet like other prophets before him
FROM THE STORY YOU MUST HAVE HEARD OR READ, JESUS WAS ARRESTED BY SOLDIERS, LED BY JEWISH RELIGION LEADERS, WAS CONDENMED BY PONTIUS PILATE AND CRUCIFIED. THAT IS HISTORY. THE QUESTION IS: WHY WAS HE EVEN ARRESTED, CONDENMED AND HANGED ON THE CROSS? WHAT WERE THE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST HIM? THAT HE DIDN'T CONFORM TO THEIR RELIGIOUS TRADITION- YOU WOULD SAY... YES OR NO. JOHN 5;18 SAYS, ''the jews sought all more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.'' YOU SEE? HE WAS ACCUSED OF BREAKING A TRADITION. BUT MORE THAN THAT, HE CLAIMED DEITY. AGAIN IN JOHN 10:30-39, THE LORD SAID, '' I and My Father are one.'' Then the jews took up stones again tO stone Him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shown you from My Father. For which of those works do ye stone Me'' The Jews answered Him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou being man, maketh thyself God'' ...If Ido not do the works of My Father, believe Me not, but if i do, though you do not believe me that the father is in me, and I in Him''. Therefore they sought again to arrest him, but He escaped out of their hand. SO, YOU SEE THAT JESUS ACTUALLY CALLED HIMSELF THE SON OF GOD, NOT ONCE, NOT TWICE. AND THAT WAS THE MAJOR REASON WHY THE RELIGIOUS PEOPLE OF HIS DAYS WERE SEEKING TO KILL HIM. THERE WAS NO SINGLE CRIME OF WHICH THEY CONVICT HIM, BUT OF WHAT THEY REGARDED AS BLASPHEMY. AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THIS IS THE SAME PROBLEM MUSLIMS HAVE WITH CHRISTIANITY- BECAUSE WE BELIEVE IN WHAT JESUS SAYS HE IS. YOU SEE, IF JESUS WERE TO BE HERE TODAY, DO YOU REALISE HE MIGHT HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS WITH ISLAMIC LEADERS AS HE HAD WITH THE PHARISEES OF HIS DAYS? [/color]
". . . and began to be sorrowful and very depressed. Then saith he unto them, ‘my soul is exceedingly sorrowful, even unto death' . . ."
"And he went a little further, and fell on his face (Exactly as the Muslim does in Salaat), and prayed, saying, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as thou wilt."
(This is the quality of a good Muslim who submits his will to the will of God).
(HOLY BIBLE) Matthew 26: 37-39
"And being in an agony, he prayed more earnestly;
and his sweat was, as it were, great drops of blood falling down to the ground’’
(HOLY BIBLE) Luke 22:44
If he was God or son of God, why was he not prepared? Why all this bewailing and lamentation? Is he crying to save his skin? It would be highly cynical on his part to do that! Did he not advise others:
"And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out . . . And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee; for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell."
(HOLY BIBLE) Matthew 5:29-30
We would be doing Jesus a grave injustice if we thought that he was crying like a woman to save his body from physical harm. He was crying for his people — the Jews. They held a queer logic, that if they succeeded in killing any would-be Messiah (Christ), it would be a sure proof of his imposture. For God Almighty will never allow His truly "anointed one" (Christ) 1 to be killed — (Deuteronomy 18:20).
Jesus was never aware From the "call to arms" in the upper-room, and the masterful deployment of forces at Gethsemane, and the blood-sweating prayer to the God of Mercy for help, it appears that Jesus knew nothing about the contract for his crucifixion. It reminds one of the Biblical Abraham, leading his son to the slaughter with the bluff that the Lord will provide a 'scape-goat.'
If this was God's plan for a vicarious atonement to redeem mankind, then obviously He had chosen a wrong substitute. This candidate was most reluctant to die. Arming! Wailingi Sweating! Crying! Complaining! 1 Contrast these responses with those of Lord Nelson, a war-hero, who gave up the ghost with these undying words:
"THANK GOD, I HAVE DONE MY DUTY!". There are millions today, who would happily immolate themselves for king and country, with smiles on their faces, with shouts of "Allahu-akbar!" or "God save the Queen!" Jesus was an un-willing victim. If this was God's scheme of salvation, then it was a heartless plot. It was murder in the first degree, and not redeeming self-sacrifice.
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 10-06-2010 05:37 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 10-06-2010 05:43 PM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD?
To answer that question of yours we are informed in the Qur'an:
"And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said 'Who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The apostles said, 'we are Gods helpers. We believe in God; so bear witness of our submission God, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness. 'And they devised, and God devised, and God devised, and God is the best of divisors. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to Me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you (of the falsehoods) of those who do not believe. I will make your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day."(Al-Imran 3:52-55)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was taken and raised to heaven. He was not crucified. It was certainly the plan of the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and someone else was crucified.
"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a grave false charge, and for their saying, 'We killed the messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messiah of God"…yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him are surely in doubt the following of conjecture; and they did not kill him of certainty…no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, Allwise. There is not one of the people of the book but will assuredly believe him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (An-Nissa 4:156-159)
The Quran does not explain who was the person crucified instead of Jesus, nor elaborate on the Second Coming of Jesus. However, explanators of the Quran have always interpreted the last verse of the above quotation to mean that Jesus will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings (Hadith) of the Prophet Mohammed may the peace and blessings of Allah him and upon all His Messengers.
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 10-06-2010 05:43 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 10-06-2010 08:22 PM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD?
To answer that question of yours we are informed in the Qur'an:
"And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said 'Who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The apostles said, 'we are Gods helpers. We believe in God; so bear witness of our submission God, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness. 'And they devised, and God devised, and God devised, and God is the best of divisors. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to Me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you (of the falsehoods) of those who do not believe. I will make your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day."(Al-Imran 3:52-55)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was taken and raised to heaven. He was not crucified. It was certainly the plan of the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and someone else was crucified.
"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a grave false charge, and for their saying, 'We killed the messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messiah of God"…yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him are surely in doubt the following of conjecture; and they did not kill him of certainty…no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, Allwise. There is not one of the people of the book but will assuredly believe him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (An-Nissa 4:156-159)
The Quran does not explain who was the person crucified instead of Jesus, nor elaborate on the Second Coming of Jesus. However, explanators of the Quran have always interpreted the last verse of the above quotation to mean that Jesus will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings (Hadith) of the Prophet Mohammed may the peace and blessings of Allah him and upon all His Messengers.
NO, NO NO AND NO, IT WOULD NOT STAND TO PROVE YOUR POINT NEITHER WILL IT SETTLE IT. IN FACT, THOSE VERSES YOU QOUTED FROM QURAN (SURA 4:157-158 AL HILALI ET AL), COMPLICATE THE ISSUE MORE THAN YOU MAY REALISE. FOR EXAMPLE, MANY SECTS OF ISLAM HAVE THEIR DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS OF THESE TWO VERSES. SO WHATEVER INTERPRETATION YOU GIVE IT IS NOT CONCLUSIVE. I AM HAPPY YOU HAVE QUOTED FROM PROFESSORS AL HILALI AND MUHSIN KHAN'S TRANSLATION. YOU WIIL NOTICE THAT THESE PROFESSORS OF ARABIC HAVE INSERTED MANY WORDS IN BRACKETS TO EXPLAIN THE VERSES BECAUSE THEY ARE AWARE OF THE CONTROVERSIES BEHIND THE VERSES. NOW, I AM NOT INTERESTED IN EXAMINING THE VARIOUS ISLAM INTERPRETATION OF THIS. ALL I WANT US TO SEE IS THIS: THE QURAN IS QUOTING THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS AS SAYING, WE KILL MESSIAH ISA(JESUS), SON OF MARYAM (MARY), THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH. I WANT REALISE THAT THAT STATEMENT IS AN IMPOSSIBLE STATEMENT. THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS COULD NEVER HAVE SAID SO. THEY NEVER BELIEVE JESUS TO BE THE MESSIAH. IF THE BELIEVED JESUS WAS THE MESSIAH, THEY COULD NEVER HAVE KILLED HIM OR EVEN ATTEMPTED TO DO SO. IT WAS EXACTLY BECAUSE THEY FELT HE WAS NOT WHAT HE CLAIMED TO BE - NAMELY THE MESSIAH- THAT THAT THEY FELT THEY HAD TO ELIMINATE HIM FOR DECEIVING THEM OR RAISING THEIR HOPE IN VAIN.NOW LET ME ASK THIS- WITH RESPECT TO WHATEVER YOU BELIEVE; IF QURAN WAS TRUELY INSPIRED BY GOD OR WRITEN BY GOD, HOW COULD IT DENY A FACT OF HISTORY? BY DENYING THE CRUCIFIXION OF CHRIST, THE QURAN CRUCIFIES ITSELF! I WILL ADVISE YOU, PRESONALLY, THAT IF SOMETHING HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED HISTORICALLY, YOU DONT GO ABOUT DENYING IT OR YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF TO RIDICULE. OTHERS MAY BE DOING THAT BECAUSE OF SOME FINANCIAL GAINS THEY AREGETTING FROM ISLAM BY ATTACKING THE CHRISTIANS FAITH. LET US CHERISH INTELLECTUAL DIGNITY. WE HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHY IT IS ONLY IN ISLAM THAT PEOPLE DENY THE DEATH OF CHRIST, OTHER RELIGIONS RESPECT HISTORY. THE ONLY ''PROOF'' MUSLIMS PRESENT FROM THEIR QURAN IS THAT MOHAMMED SAW A VISION FRON ALLAH DENYING THE DEATH OF CHRIST. ALL WE CAN SAY HERE IS THAT A VISION THAT DENIES HISTORY PUTS ITSELF INTO THE CATEGORY OF deceptio visus. [/color] | Posted: at 10-06-2010 08:22 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 11-06-2010 11:53 AM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD?
To answer that question of yours we are informed in the Qur'an:
"And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said 'Who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The apostles said, 'we are Gods helpers. We believe in God; so bear witness of our submission God, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness. 'And they devised, and God devised, and God devised, and God is the best of divisors. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to Me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you (of the falsehoods) of those who do not believe. I will make your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day."(Al-Imran 3:52-55)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was taken and raised to heaven. He was not crucified. It was certainly the plan of the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and someone else was crucified.
"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a grave false charge, and for their saying, 'We killed the messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messiah of God"…yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him are surely in doubt the following of conjecture; and they did not kill him of certainty…no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, Allwise. There is not one of the people of the book but will assuredly believe him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (An-Nissa 4:156-159)
The Quran does not explain who was the person crucified instead of Jesus, nor elaborate on the Second Coming of Jesus. However, explanators of the Quran have always interpreted the last verse of the above quotation to mean that Jesus will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings (Hadith) of the Prophet Mohammed may the peace and blessings of Allah him and upon all His Messengers.
NO, NO NO AND NO, IT WOULD NOT STAND TO PROVE YOUR POINT NEITHER WILL IT SETTLE IT. IN FACT, THOSE VERSES YOU QOUTED FROM QURAN (SURA 4:157-158 AL HILALI ET AL), COMPLICATE THE ISSUE MORE THAN YOU MAY REALISE. FOR EXAMPLE, MANY SECTS OF ISLAM HAVE THEIR DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS OF THESE TWO VERSES. SO WHATEVER INTERPRETATION YOU GIVE IT IS NOT CONCLUSIVE. I AM HAPPY YOU HAVE QUOTED FROM PROFESSORS AL HILALI AND MUHSIN KHAN'S TRANSLATION. YOU WIIL NOTICE THAT THESE PROFESSORS OF ARABIC HAVE INSERTED MANY WORDS IN BRACKETS TO EXPLAIN THE VERSES BECAUSE THEY ARE AWARE OF THE CONTROVERSIES BEHIND THE VERSES. NOW, I AM NOT INTERESTED IN EXAMINING THE VARIOUS ISLAM INTERPRETATION OF THIS. ALL I WANT US TO SEE IS THIS: THE QURAN IS QUOTING THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS AS SAYING, WE KILL MESSIAH ISA(JESUS), SON OF MARYAM (MARY), THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH. I WANT REALISE THAT THAT STATEMENT IS AN IMPOSSIBLE STATEMENT. THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS COULD NEVER HAVE SAID SO. THEY NEVER BELIEVE JESUS TO BE THE MESSIAH. IF THE BELIEVED JESUS WAS THE MESSIAH, THEY COULD NEVER HAVE KILLED HIM OR EVEN ATTEMPTED TO DO SO. IT WAS EXACTLY BECAUSE THEY FELT HE WAS NOT WHAT HE CLAIMED TO BE - NAMELY THE MESSIAH- THAT THAT THEY FELT THEY HAD TO ELIMINATE HIM FOR DECEIVING THEM OR RAISING THEIR HOPE IN VAIN.NOW LET ME ASK THIS- WITH RESPECT TO WHATEVER YOU BELIEVE; IF QURAN WAS TRUELY INSPIRED BY GOD OR WRITEN BY GOD, HOW COULD IT DENY A FACT OF HISTORY? BY DENYING THE CRUCIFIXION OF CHRIST, THE QURAN CRUCIFIES ITSELF! I WILL ADVISE YOU, PRESONALLY, THAT IF SOMETHING HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED HISTORICALLY, YOU DONT GO ABOUT DENYING IT OR YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF TO RIDICULE. OTHERS MAY BE DOING THAT BECAUSE OF SOME FINANCIAL GAINS THEY AREGETTING FROM ISLAM BY ATTACKING THE CHRISTIANS FAITH. LET US CHERISH INTELLECTUAL DIGNITY. WE HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHY IT IS ONLY IN ISLAM THAT PEOPLE DENY THE DEATH OF CHRIST, OTHER RELIGIONS RESPECT HISTORY. THE ONLY ''PROOF'' MUSLIMS PRESENT FROM THEIR QURAN IS THAT MOHAMMED SAW A VISION FRON ALLAH DENYING THE DEATH OF CHRIST. ALL WE CAN SAY HERE IS THAT A VISION THAT DENIES HISTORY PUTS ITSELF INTO THE CATEGORY OF deceptio visus. [/color]
The holy bible states that : "And this is life eternal that they should know Thee the only True God and Jesus Christ whom Thou has sent." (John 17:3).
I accept this message of Christ Jesus just like many other Muslims and we muslims do not deny History of Christianity but what you believe in is what is called Conjecture.
What was said in the book of John has been the same as what the Holy Quran was telling mankind for the past fourteen hundred years - that all must believe in the One and Only God Almighty, and Jesus Christ is only a Messenger of God. The words of the Holy Quran are as follows:-
"Most Certainly the Messiah, Jesus the son of Mary, was an apostle of Allah and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary and a Spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His Apostles" (The Holy Quran 4:171)
And the Holy bible further makes this clear: "A new commandment I give unto you. That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another." "By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love for one another." (John 13:34-35)
What is so hard to comprehend in the verse above, the message of Christ Jesus was clear and simple.
You have insulted just like many others have done but let me ask you inemx, what manner of Christianity is that for being rude and insultive? Do not forget what Christ said:
"Judge not that ye be not judged." "For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged; and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again." (Matthew 7:1-2)
Now regarding interpretations, scholars are not God neither Prophets. Let me draw your attention to the book of Luke:
"And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli," (Luke 3:23)
"(As was supposed). "Do you see that the words 'As was supposed' are written within brackets?" well if not yours i can find that in many Bible. Can you please tell me why the words are in Bracket?
"If you do not know, then let me tell you what the brackets are doing there in this verse. You do not have to take the trouble of looking for a Bible scholar."
In the "most ancient" manuscripts of Luke, the words "As was supposed" are not there. Your translators felt that without this interpolation the, ordinary Christians, not well grounded in faith, might slip and fall into the error of believing that Joseph the Carpenter was the actual physical father of Jesus. So they took the precaution of adding their own comment in brackets to avoid any misunderstanding.
"I am not trying to find fault with your system of adding words in brackets to assist the reader, but what intrigues me is that in all translations of the Bible in the African and Eastern languages you have retained the words "as was supposed" but have removed the brackets!. Couldn't the nations of the Earth besides the English understand the meaning and purpose of the brackets?
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 11-06-2010 11:53 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Harunshehu") Harunshehu at 11-06-2010 12:33 PM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD?
To answer that question of yours we are informed in the Qur'an:
"And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said 'Who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The apostles said, 'we are Gods helpers. We believe in God; so bear witness of our submission God, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness. 'And they devised, and God devised, and God devised, and God is the best of divisors. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to Me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you (of the falsehoods) of those who do not believe. I will make your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day."(Al-Imran 3:52-55)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was taken and raised to heaven. He was not crucified. It was certainly the plan of the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and someone else was crucified.
"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a grave false charge, and for their saying, 'We killed the messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messiah of God"…yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him are surely in doubt the following of conjecture; and they did not kill him of certainty…no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, Allwise. There is not one of the people of the book but will assuredly believe him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (An-Nissa 4:156-159)
The Quran does not explain who was the person crucified instead of Jesus, nor elaborate on the Second Coming of Jesus. However, explanators of the Quran have always interpreted the last verse of the above quotation to mean that Jesus will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings (Hadith) of the Prophet Mohammed may the peace and blessings of Allah him and upon all His Messengers.
NO, NO NO AND NO, IT WOULD NOT STAND TO PROVE YOUR POINT NEITHER WILL IT SETTLE IT. IN FACT, THOSE VERSES YOU QOUTED FROM QURAN (SURA 4:157-158 AL HILALI ET AL), COMPLICATE THE ISSUE MORE THAN YOU MAY REALISE. FOR EXAMPLE, MANY SECTS OF ISLAM HAVE THEIR DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS OF THESE TWO VERSES. SO WHATEVER INTERPRETATION YOU GIVE IT IS NOT CONCLUSIVE. I AM HAPPY YOU HAVE QUOTED FROM PROFESSORS AL HILALI AND MUHSIN KHAN'S TRANSLATION. YOU WIIL NOTICE THAT THESE PROFESSORS OF ARABIC HAVE INSERTED MANY WORDS IN BRACKETS TO EXPLAIN THE VERSES BECAUSE THEY ARE AWARE OF THE CONTROVERSIES BEHIND THE VERSES. NOW, I AM NOT INTERESTED IN EXAMINING THE VARIOUS ISLAM INTERPRETATION OF THIS. ALL I WANT US TO SEE IS THIS: THE QURAN IS QUOTING THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS AS SAYING, WE KILL MESSIAH ISA(JESUS), SON OF MARYAM (MARY), THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH. I WANT REALISE THAT THAT STATEMENT IS AN IMPOSSIBLE STATEMENT. THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS COULD NEVER HAVE SAID SO. THEY NEVER BELIEVE JESUS TO BE THE MESSIAH. IF THE BELIEVED JESUS WAS THE MESSIAH, THEY COULD NEVER HAVE KILLED HIM OR EVEN ATTEMPTED TO DO SO. IT WAS EXACTLY BECAUSE THEY FELT HE WAS NOT WHAT HE CLAIMED TO BE - NAMELY THE MESSIAH- THAT THAT THEY FELT THEY HAD TO ELIMINATE HIM FOR DECEIVING THEM OR RAISING THEIR HOPE IN VAIN.NOW LET ME ASK THIS- WITH RESPECT TO WHATEVER YOU BELIEVE; IF QURAN WAS TRUELY INSPIRED BY GOD OR WRITEN BY GOD, HOW COULD IT DENY A FACT OF HISTORY? BY DENYING THE CRUCIFIXION OF CHRIST, THE QURAN CRUCIFIES ITSELF! I WILL ADVISE YOU, PRESONALLY, THAT IF SOMETHING HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED HISTORICALLY, YOU DONT GO ABOUT DENYING IT OR YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF TO RIDICULE. OTHERS MAY BE DOING THAT BECAUSE OF SOME FINANCIAL GAINS THEY AREGETTING FROM ISLAM BY ATTACKING THE CHRISTIANS FAITH. LET US CHERISH INTELLECTUAL DIGNITY. WE HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHY IT IS ONLY IN ISLAM THAT PEOPLE DENY THE DEATH OF CHRIST, OTHER RELIGIONS RESPECT HISTORY. THE ONLY ''PROOF'' MUSLIMS PRESENT FROM THEIR QURAN IS THAT MOHAMMED SAW A VISION FRON ALLAH DENYING THE DEATH OF CHRIST. ALL WE CAN SAY HERE IS THAT A VISION THAT DENIES HISTORY PUTS ITSELF INTO THE CATEGORY OF deceptio visus. [/color]
Why should they be terrified?" When one recognizes one's long-lost friend or one's beloved, the natural reaction is to feel overjoyed, elated and one wants to embrace and kiss the hands and feet of the beloved. Why did they get terrified?" you might want to reply that replied that they (the disciples) thought that they were seeing a ghost." Now i would want to ask you"Did Jesus look like a ghost? if your answer is "no" "Then why did they think that they were seeing a ghost when he did not look like a ghost?"
"You see, Inemx, the disciples of Jesus were not eye-witnesses or ear-witnesses to the actual happenings of the previous three days, as vouched for by St. Mark who says that at the most critical juncture in the life of Jesus: "they all forsook him and fled." (Mark 14:50). All the knowledge of the disciples regarding their Master was from hearsay. They had heard that their master was hanged on the Cross; they had heard that he had given up the Ghost; they had heard that he was dead and buried for three days. If one is confronted by a person with such a reputation then the conclusion is inescapable; they must be seeing a ghost. Little wonder these ten brave men were petrified."
"To disabuse their minds from the fear that gripped them, Jesus reasoned with them. He said: 'Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself' To put it in simple English, this is how he told them: 'What is wrong with you fellows, can't you see that I am the same person - who walked and talked with you, broke bread with you - flesh and blood in all respects.'
Why do doubts enter your minds? 'Handle me and see, for a spirit has no flesh and bones as you see me have.' (Luke 24:39). In other words he is telling them: 'If I have flesh and bones, then I am not a ghost, not a spook and not a spirit!'" "Is that right Inemx?
Jesus is telling them, as recorded in this verse, in basic English, that what the disciples were asked to "handle and see" was not a translated body, not a metamorphosed body and not a resurrected body, because a resurrected body is a spiritualised body. He is telling them in the clearest language humanly possible that he is not what they were thinking. They were thinking that he was a spirit, a resurrected body, one having been brought back from the dead. He is most emphatic that he is not!"
"Please Inemx tell me as to who is lying? Is it Jesus or a thousand million Christians of the world? Jesus says: "No!" to his being resurrected, and all of you say: "Yes!" Whom are we Muslims to believe, Jesus or his so called disciples? We Muslims would rather believe the Master. Did he not say: "The disciple is not greater than the Master."? (Matthew 10:24)
Now here is the verse from Luke discussed put together :
"..Jesus himself stood in their midst, and said unto them, Peace be unto you...But they were terrified, and supposing that they were seeing a spirit... And he said unto them,.. 'Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me and see; for a spirit has no flesh and bones, as you see me have'... And showed them his hands and feet... And while they yet believed not for joy and wondered, he said unto them, 'Have ye here any meat?'.. And they gave him a piece of broiled fish, and of a honeycomb... And he took it, and did eat before them." (Luke 24:36-43)
God is the Light, Everlasting..... | Posted: at 11-06-2010 12:33 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 14-06-2010 01:29 PM (13 years ago) (m) SO, WHERE IS HE IF HE WAS NOT KILL BY YOUR FATHERS WHO CALL EVIL GOOD?
To answer that question of yours we are informed in the Qur'an:
"And when Jesus perceived their unbelief, he said 'Who will be my helpers in the cause of God? The apostles said, 'we are Gods helpers. We believe in God; so bear witness of our submission God, we believe in that you have sent down, and we follow the Messenger. Inscribe us therefore with those who bear witness. 'And they devised, and God devised, and God devised, and God is the best of divisors. When God said, 'Jesus, I will take you to Me and will raise you to Me, and I will purify you (of the falsehoods) of those who do not believe. I will make your followers above the unbelievers till the Resurrection Day."(Al-Imran 3:52-55)
As the above verses indicate, Jesus was taken and raised to heaven. He was not crucified. It was certainly the plan of the enemies of Jesus to put him to death on the cross, but God saved him and someone else was crucified.
"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a grave false charge, and for their saying, 'We killed the messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messiah of God"…yet they did not slay him, neither crucified him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at variance concerning him are surely in doubt the following of conjecture; and they did not kill him of certainty…no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty, Allwise. There is not one of the people of the book but will assuredly believe him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day he will be a witness against them." (An-Nissa 4:156-159)
The Quran does not explain who was the person crucified instead of Jesus, nor elaborate on the Second Coming of Jesus. However, explanators of the Quran have always interpreted the last verse of the above quotation to mean that Jesus will believe in him before he dies. This understanding is supported by authentic sayings (Hadith) of the Prophet Mohammed may the peace and blessings of Allah him and upon all His Messengers.
NO, NO NO AND NO, IT WOULD NOT STAND TO PROVE YOUR POINT NEITHER WILL IT SETTLE IT. IN FACT, THOSE VERSES YOU QOUTED FROM QURAN (SURA 4:157-158 AL HILALI ET AL), COMPLICATE THE ISSUE MORE THAN YOU MAY REALISE. FOR EXAMPLE, MANY SECTS OF ISLAM HAVE THEIR DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS OF THESE TWO VERSES. SO WHATEVER INTERPRETATION YOU GIVE IT IS NOT CONCLUSIVE. I AM HAPPY YOU HAVE QUOTED FROM PROFESSORS AL HILALI AND MUHSIN KHAN'S TRANSLATION. YOU WIIL NOTICE THAT THESE PROFESSORS OF ARABIC HAVE INSERTED MANY WORDS IN BRACKETS TO EXPLAIN THE VERSES BECAUSE THEY ARE AWARE OF THE CONTROVERSIES BEHIND THE VERSES. NOW, I AM NOT INTERESTED IN EXAMINING THE VARIOUS ISLAM INTERPRETATION OF THIS. ALL I WANT US TO SEE IS THIS: THE QURAN IS QUOTING THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS AS SAYING, WE KILL MESSIAH ISA(JESUS), SON OF MARYAM (MARY), THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH. I WANT REALISE THAT THAT STATEMENT IS AN IMPOSSIBLE STATEMENT. THE JEW WHO WERE THE ENEMIES OF JESUS COULD NEVER HAVE SAID SO. THEY NEVER BELIEVE JESUS TO BE THE MESSIAH. IF THE BELIEVED JESUS WAS THE MESSIAH, THEY COULD NEVER HAVE KILLED HIM OR EVEN ATTEMPTED TO DO SO. IT WAS EXACTLY BECAUSE THEY FELT HE WAS NOT WHAT HE CLAIMED TO BE - NAMELY THE MESSIAH- THAT THAT THEY FELT THEY HAD TO ELIMINATE HIM FOR DECEIVING THEM OR RAISING THEIR HOPE IN VAIN.NOW LET ME ASK THIS- WITH RESPECT TO WHATEVER YOU BELIEVE; IF QURAN WAS TRUELY INSPIRED BY GOD OR WRITEN BY GOD, HOW COULD IT DENY A FACT OF HISTORY? BY DENYING THE CRUCIFIXION OF CHRIST, THE QURAN CRUCIFIES ITSELF! I WILL ADVISE YOU, PRESONALLY, THAT IF SOMETHING HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED HISTORICALLY, YOU DONT GO ABOUT DENYING IT OR YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF TO RIDICULE. OTHERS MAY BE DOING THAT BECAUSE OF SOME FINANCIAL GAINS THEY AREGETTING FROM ISLAM BY ATTACKING THE CHRISTIANS FAITH. LET US CHERISH INTELLECTUAL DIGNITY. WE HAVE ALWAYS WONDERED WHY IT IS ONLY IN ISLAM THAT PEOPLE DENY THE DEATH OF CHRIST, OTHER RELIGIONS RESPECT HISTORY. THE ONLY ''PROOF'' MUSLIMS PRESENT FROM THEIR QURAN IS THAT MOHAMMED SAW A VISION FRON ALLAH DENYING THE DEATH OF CHRIST. ALL WE CAN SAY HERE IS THAT A VISION THAT DENIES HISTORY PUTS ITSELF INTO THE CATEGORY OF deceptio visus. [/color]
Why should they be terrified?" When one recognizes one's long-lost friend or one's beloved, the natural reaction is to feel overjoyed, elated and one wants to embrace and kiss the hands and feet of the beloved. Why did they get terrified?" you might want to reply that replied that they (the disciples) thought that they were seeing a ghost." Now i would want to ask you"Did Jesus look like a ghost? if your answer is "no" "Then why did they think that they were seeing a ghost when he did not look like a ghost?"
"You see, Inemx, the disciples of Jesus were not eye-witnesses or ear-witnesses to the actual happenings of the previous three days, as vouched for by St. Mark who says that at the most critical juncture in the life of Jesus: "they all forsook him and fled." (Mark 14:50). All the knowledge of the disciples regarding their Master was from hearsay. They had heard that their master was hanged on the Cross; they had heard that he had given up the Ghost; they had heard that he was dead and buried for three days. If one is confronted by a person with such a reputation then the conclusion is inescapable; they must be seeing a ghost. Little wonder these ten brave men were petrified."
"To disabuse their minds from the fear that gripped them, Jesus reasoned with them. He said: 'Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself' To put it in simple English, this is how he told them: 'What is wrong with you fellows, can't you see that I am the same person - who walked and talked with you, broke bread with you - flesh and blood in all respects.'
Why do doubts enter your minds? 'Handle me and see, for a spirit has no flesh and bones as you see me have.' (Luke 24:39). In other words he is telling them: 'If I have flesh and bones, then I am not a ghost, not a spook and not a spirit!'" "Is that right Inemx?
Jesus is telling them, as recorded in this verse, in basic English, that what the disciples were asked to "handle and see" was not a translated body, not a metamorphosed body and not a resurrected body, because a resurrected body is a spiritualised body. He is telling them in the clearest language humanly possible that he is not what they were thinking. They were thinking that he was a spirit, a resurrected body, one having been brought back from the dead. He is most emphatic that he is not!"
"Please Inemx tell me as to who is lying? Is it Jesus or a thousand million Christians of the world? Jesus says: "No!" to his being resurrected, and all of you say: "Yes!" Whom are we Muslims to believe, Jesus or his so called disciples? We Muslims would rather believe the Master. Did he not say: "The disciple is not greater than the Master."? (Matthew 10:24)
Now here is the verse from Luke discussed put together :
"..Jesus himself stood in their midst, and said unto them, Peace be unto you...But they were terrified, and supposing that they were seeing a spirit... And he said unto them,.. 'Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me and see; for a spirit has no flesh and bones, as you see me have'... And showed them his hands and feet... And while they yet believed not for joy and wondered, he said unto them, 'Have ye here any meat?'.. And they gave him a piece of broiled fish, and of a honeycomb... And he took it, and did eat before them." (Luke 24:36-43)[color=red ]THEY WERE PEOPLE LIKE, THE DOUBTERS JUST THE WAY YOU ARE NOW. THEY WERE LOOKING FOR A PROOF BEFORE THEY CUD BELIEVE THAT WHAT JESUS TOLD THEM ABOUT HIS DEATH AND RESURRECTION WAS TRUE. HE HAD TO PROVE THEM RIGHT BY SHOW HIMSELF REAL TO THEM. ARE YOU STILL LOOKING FOR THAT SAME PROOF? YOU WILL HAVE TO WAIT FOR A LONG TIME, PROBABLY, WHEN HE COMES BACK. [/color] | Posted: at 14-06-2010 01:29 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "cadanre") cadanre at 15-06-2010 01:16 PM (13 years ago) (f) @ inemx You may be asked question hundred times, but no single answer is expected from you because you have never, even make an attempt to answer question or show a level of maturity in understanding what has been told. You have a kind of congested brain, may never understand things how they are. Your mind is preoccupied with prejudice and biases.
IN ZAKA FADI, FADI GASKIYA, KOMAI TA JA MA A YI MAKA | Posted: at 15-06-2010 01:16 PM (13 years ago) | Hero | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 15-06-2010 01:54 PM (13 years ago) (m) @ inemx
You may be asked question hundred times, but no single answer is expected from you because you have never, even make an attempt to answer question or show a level of maturity in understanding what has been told. You have a kind of congested brain, may never understand things how they are. Your mind is preoccupied with prejudice and biases.
YEA, BECAUSE I REFUSE TO BE CONFUSED LIKE YOU ARE. I HAVE BEEN BOUGHT WITH THE PRECIOUS PRICE: THE BLOOD OF JESUS, WHICH MAHAMMED CUD NOT OFFER YOU EXCEPT COMPLETE CONFUSION. | Posted: at 15-06-2010 01:54 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "The-s-man") The-s-man at 20-06-2010 02:45 PM (13 years ago) (m) All the christians u know the true is just that u dont want to admit it. | Posted: at 20-06-2010 02:45 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 21-06-2010 03:56 PM (13 years ago) (m) All the christians u know the true is just that u dont want to admit it.
THAT MUHAMMAD IS IN HEAVEN? WHAT TRUTH? | Posted: at 21-06-2010 03:56 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 25-06-2010 12:10 PM (13 years ago) (m) All the christians u know the true is just that u dont want to admit it.
THAT MUHAMMAD IS IN HEAVEN? WHAT TRUTH? | Posted: at 25-06-2010 12:10 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "princedafe") princedafe at 6-07-2010 12:22 PM (13 years ago) (m) What a senseless post | Posted: at 6-07-2010 12:22 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 6-07-2010 02:35 PM (13 years ago) (m) What a senseless post
@PRINCEDAFE.
JUST LIKE YOUR SENSELESS HEAD. | Posted: at 6-07-2010 02:35 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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PASSING | Posted: at 20-07-2010 03:41 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "mubaji") mubaji at 21-07-2010 11:18 AM (13 years ago) (m) What a senseless post
 | Posted: at 21-07-2010 11:18 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 21-07-2010 11:49 AM (13 years ago) (m) like a senseless muhammad | Posted: at 21-07-2010 11:49 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
Reply |
![-]( "Inemx") Inemx at 21-07-2010 04:11 PM (13 years ago) (m) Do not die except u are a muslim. And i want u 2 know strongly dat jesus did not die, u are being deceived,or u go and ask the true and best pastor in d world.2 b explained 2 u later.......PEACE......
IF JESUS DID NOT DIE THEN YOU WILL DIE AND DIE AGAIN. | Posted: at 21-07-2010 04:11 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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Harunshehu
Inemx
cadanre
The-s-man
princedafe
solid_solid
mubaji
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