CammyWhite at 16-07-2011 08:55 AM (13 years ago) (f) Actually Democrazy in on to something. Yeshuah Meshiach was preaching to the Hebrews, not the Gentiles, and there's nothing about creating a church in anything he said. Christianity was indeed the work of Paul and those like him who disregarded Yeshuah's command to stay away from the Gentiles and preach only to the Lost Sheep of Israel. Report to moderator Logged Cammywhite you have goofed there that Jesus never preached to the Gentiles.This is not true.Do you remember the woman of samaria at the well (John 4:7),the woman who asked that her child be healed and Christ told her that it is not good to give the children meat to the dog.But the woman said that the dos eat from the crumbs that fall from the table and Christ said,'go thy way for thy faith has made your child whole'.Also,in Acts 1:8,the scriptures stated that you shall recieve power...and you shall be my witness in Judea,in Samaria and in outer most part of the earth.This does not in any way accord with your claim.This is actually the foundation of the church.Remember when the Master asked His Disciples who men said He is and when Peter answered Him saying that 'Your are the Christ,son of the Most High'.Christ replied 'Flesh and blood did not reveal this to you and upon this rock ,I shall build my church and the gate of hell shall not prevail against it.So,can you still credit Paul with the founding of the church? Matthew 15:24: But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
That's what your Bible says Yeshuah said. Sounds pretty clear to me! Posted: at 16-07-2011 08:55 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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democrazy at 16-07-2011 10:16 AM (13 years ago) (m) hahahahaha @CammyWhite sounds like the Jesus I know. Its a shame that hosbert, in the story he quoted, did not know that Jesus showed to the people that he is not here to help anyone that is not a Jew. He did not help the woman, she helped herself by believing she will receive healing. But come to think of it, I know Hosbert's understanding is suspect!! I did not say knowledge cos I cant see any in him. TRUTH!! Give you an example .................... Christianity is a religion created to worship the risen christ!! If Jesus christ did not rise from the dead, then there is no significance of christian religion....IT WILL NEVER EXIST.... So HOSBERT!!! tell me what type of church Jesus christ was refering to start or build on peter? Or what religion was Jesus Christ practising.................Or was there no religion at that time? Or maybe he was an Atheist then!!! Show your ignorance.........................I dont mind you butting out as I can safely tell the world, you have no answer to any of these questions I've asked. Posted: at 16-07-2011 10:16 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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hosbert at 16-07-2011 09:32 PM (13 years ago) (m) Matthew 15:24: But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
That's what your Bible says Yeshuah said. Sounds pretty clear to me! Report to moderator Logged democrazy [Male] Offline Posts: 766 Upcoming THE EXISTENCE OF THE CHRISTIAN GOD NEEDS NO FURTHER PROOF. (Page 6) « posted : July 16, 2011, 10:16:39 AM (9 hrs ago) »
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hahahahaha @CammyWhite sounds like the Jesus I know. Its a shame that hosbert, in the story he quoted, did not know that Jesus showed to the people that he is not here to help anyone that is not a Jew. He did not help the woman, she helped herself by believing she will receive healing.
But come to think of it, I know Hosbert's understanding is suspect!! I did not say knowledge cos I cant see any in him. TRUTH!!
Give you an example ....................
Christianity is a religion created to worship the risen christ!! If Jesus christ did not rise from the dead, then there is no significance of christian religion....IT WILL NEVER EXIST....
So HOSBERT!!! tell me what type of church Jesus christ was refering to start or build on peter? Or what religion was Jesus Christ practising.................Or was there no religion at that time? Or maybe he was an Atheist then!!! Show your ignorance.........................I dont mind you butting out as I can safely tell the world, you have no answer to any of these questions I've asked. @Cammywhite The scripture you qouted is clear as you said but a whole study of Chapter 15 of Matthew would give you a background and also help you understand why Jesus made that statement.Don't for get that at the time,the Jews held tenaciously to the law and traditions of their fathers believing that therein lies salvation wherein they became the lost sheep as it were.So Christ ministry at the time was to lead the Jews out of their lost state.The reason for this was because wanted to fulfil His promise to Abraham and at the time the woman approached Jesus,the gospel was not yet fully preached to the Jews but even as a non Jew,she believed and demonstrated faith in the power of God in Christ Jesus and her request was obliged.In other words,the Jews were at the time still God's chosen people and this was restated in Romans 1:16;the gospel being preached to the Jews first,then the Gentiles.The interesting thing is that when Christ died on the cross,all these changed following the destruction of the curtain or veil that seperated the holy of holiest which symbolised presence of God in Israel and gave all the freedom to approach God directly through Christ which hitherto was impossible. @Democracy The woman helped herself by believing in what? People believe in so many thigs but only believing in Christ that you can reap of the promises He made.The woman cried out because she has seen Jesus do what he says and when she did believe in Christ as the Messiah,her heart desire was granted her by Christ.Acts 10:38 explains it all that how God annionted Jesus Christ of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost who went about doing good and healing all that were possessed of the devil.Only Jesus can declare and it comes to pass. It is most unfortunate that you are yet to understand that christianity is not a religion but a life of God that was brought to man by Christ when he defeated devil and his cohorts of hell.when God created man in Genesis 1:26,God gave man authority to rule,dorminate and be in full control of the things He (God) created because man was the express image and likeness of God.This pwoer,attribute and domineering aura was shortcircuited and relinguished to the devil when the latter decieved man.However,God still loved man and desired to restore man to his lost power,glory and splendour hence the birth,death and resurrection of Christ.Most significant was the resurrection because it resotred those who believe and others who would dare to believe to what the devil stole from them.The problem in the world is people trying to protect their rligion but Christ never intoduced any religion but showed men the way to God the Father.Christ concern while here on earth and even now is that men should do the will of God. You see part of your problem is that you do not even understand all these that is why you what to see proofs but you cannot see any as long as you are still spiritually blind and tied to the apron string of whatever religion you practised.So you now know why Jesus said He was sent to the lost sheep of the Jews.It is their observation and holding on to religious and traditional tenents that made them lost.The salvation Christ wrought is for all men so take advantage of it brother. Posted: at 16-07-2011 09:32 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 16-07-2011 09:55 PM (13 years ago) (m) @democracy Talking about knowledge,I do not need your affirmation or attestation to be conscious of who I am.Worst still,if it is your kind of knowledge,I do not need it and as usual,I want to still advise you to always try to limit yourself to the issue(s) of the argument rather than exhibit puckish and pugnacious dispositions without contributing any thing to the argument in the final analysis,just playing to the gallery. Posted: at 16-07-2011 09:55 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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CammyWhite at 17-07-2011 02:12 AM (13 years ago) (f) Matthew 15:24: But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”
That's what your Bible says Yeshuah said. Sounds pretty clear to me! Report to moderator Logged democrazy [Male] Offline Posts: 766 Upcoming THE EXISTENCE OF THE CHRISTIAN GOD NEEDS NO FURTHER PROOF. (Page 6) « posted : July 16, 2011, 10:16:39 AM (9 hrs ago) »
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It is most unfortunate that you are yet to understand that christianity is not a religion I think we had this claim before, and it still makes no sense. Posted: at 17-07-2011 02:12 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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hosbert at 17-07-2011 02:59 AM (13 years ago) (m) It is most unfortunate that you are yet to understand that christianity is not a religion
I think we had this claim before, and it still makes no sense. How do you mean that it still makes no sense?. Posted: at 17-07-2011 02:59 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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democrazy at 17-07-2011 10:07 AM (13 years ago) (m) @hosbert You are the one that's going off point. I am telling you and showing you that the existence of your GOD is in doubt and is very very untrue. I have asked you questions regarding your answers on this forum, BUT yet, all you do is make statements offerring no proof or fact. You did not answer the question of if GOD is a person! (I already started a fight on this to know more) I then took it GOD's person as per your inputs is manifested in Jesus Christ. So again, I asked you who built the church after your wrong assumption. You did not answer but come make statements again. Now, I will ask you this again..........As per your faith and believe system. DO you and Christianity believe in ONE GOD. Where can you support that view? Posted: at 17-07-2011 10:07 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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CammyWhite at 17-07-2011 12:55 PM (13 years ago) (f) It is most unfortunate that you are yet to understand that christianity is not a religion
I think we had this claim before, and it still makes no sense. How do you mean that it still makes no sense?. Claiming that Christianity is not a religion is what makes no sense. Posted: at 17-07-2011 12:55 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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hosbert at 17-07-2011 07:53 PM (13 years ago) (m) Claiming that Christianity is not a religion is what makes no sense Cammywhite When you have an understanding of this revelation,it would have made sense to you that christianity is not a religion.In John 18:36,Jesus made it clear that His kingdom is not of this world.He further stated that though believers are in the world ,there are not of the world.If you say the Lord's prayer (Matthew 6:6-13 and Luke 11:2-4),of particular interest in this discuss is the portion "...Thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven...".Religion as it were is a 1.beliefs and worship: people's beliefs and opinions concerning the existence, nature, and worship of a deity or deities, and divine involvement in the universe and human life 2.system: an institutionalized or personal system of beliefs and practices relating to the divine 3.personal beliefs or values: a set of strongly-held beliefs, values, and attitudes that somebody lives by All the above conceptions of religion do not accord with christianity even though some christians say so out of ignorance and I say this with all sense of humility without being immodest.Christ came to show us the way to God and while here on earth,He was the express image of God because the scripture recorded in Colossians 1:19 that in Him (Christ) dwells the God head bodily i.e the totality or fullness of God dwelled in Him.By this declaration,our worship of God is not based on beliefs or opinions concerning His existence as Deity.God is real and we christians know so and are not expressing opinion about his existence.This is not the same with religion which is more of man-made traditions like the type held by the Jews which I talked about last night.We're actually operating in the kingdom of Heaven,Zion.I refer you to Hebrews 12-22-24 "22But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel". Did you make out anything from this? Posted: at 17-07-2011 07:53 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 17-07-2011 08:58 PM (13 years ago) (m) [@hosbert
You are the one that's going off point. I am telling you and showing you that the existence of your GOD is in doubt and is very very untrue.
I have asked you questions regarding your answers on this forum, BUT yet, all you do is make statements offerring no proof or fact.
You did not answer the question of if GOD is a person! (I already started a fight on this to know more) I then took it GOD's person as per your inputs is manifested in Jesus Christ.
So again, I asked you who built the church after your wrong assumption. You did not answer but come make statements again.
Now, I will ask you this again..........As per your faith and believe system.
DO you and Christianity believe in ONE GOD. Where can you support that view?/quote]
@Democracy The last time I checked,You made references to written materials by men like you and I to substantiate your claims that God's existence is in doubt or untrue,yet when I refer you to another material and a more authentic one at that,you try to trivilize and discredit my position by reaching to what you percieve as inconsistencies in the Bible as a ground upon which my position should not and must not stand.I want point to point proof of every issue raised.I remembered telling you in that fight that as human persons,we are our words.A man who does not go down on his words is considered a man of integrity right? Inspite of whatever inconsistencies you seemed to have seen in the Bible,it has remained infailable and immutable,a point indicating that He that spoke is alive and seing to it that the words come to pass (Isaiah 55:11)
Also,do you think the church is the buildings or the different denominations in the christendom? Of course no,hell No.The church is a believer hence the declaration in 1 Corinthians 6:19-20 that your body is the Temple of the Holy Ghost.The statement of Christ to Peter Matthew 16:18 about building the church was about the confession of Peter that He (Christ) is the Christ,Son of the Living God.Christ actually meant that that declaration of Him as the The Christ is the truth upon which the gospel is reconcilation of the world to God would be based.May be a study of verses 13-20 would help you understand this:
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?” 14 So they said, “Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.” 15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” 17 Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed[a] in heaven.” 20 Then He commanded His disciples that they should tell no one that He was Jesus the Christ.
As to whether I believ in One God ,yes I do.I support my view with this scripture below: 1 Corinthians 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live. I do not want to prempt you but I do know where you are driving at and we'll cross that bridge when we get there. Posted: at 17-07-2011 08:58 PM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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democrazy at 17-07-2011 11:46 PM (13 years ago) (m) @hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree? Posted: at 17-07-2011 11:46 PM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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CammyWhite at 18-07-2011 01:44 AM (13 years ago) (f) Claiming that Christianity is not a religion is what makes no sense Cammywhite When you have an understanding of this revelation,it would have made sense to you that christianity is not a religion.In John 18:36,Jesus made it clear that His kingdom is not of this world.He further stated that though believers are in the world ,there are not of the world.If you say the Lord's prayer (Matthew 6:6-13 and Luke 11:2-4),of particular interest in this discuss is the portion "...Thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven...".Religion as it were is a 1.beliefs and worship: people's beliefs and opinions concerning the existence, nature, and worship of a deity or deities, and divine involvement in the universe and human life 2.system: an institutionalized or personal system of beliefs and practices relating to the divine 3.personal beliefs or values: a set of strongly-held beliefs, values, and attitudes that somebody lives by All the above conceptions of religion do not accord with christianity even though some christians say so out of ignorance and I say this with all sense of humility without being immodest.Christ came to show us the way to God and while here on earth,He was the express image of God because the scripture recorded in Colossians 1:19 that in Him (Christ) dwells the God head bodily i.e the totality or fullness of God dwelled in Him.By this declaration,our worship of God is not based on beliefs or opinions concerning His existence as Deity.God is real and we christians know so and are not expressing opinion about his existence.This is not the same with religion which is more of man-made traditions like the type held by the Jews which I talked about last night.We're actually operating in the kingdom of Heaven,Zion.I refer you to Hebrews 12-22-24 "22But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel". Did you make out anything from this? What I make of that is that you can write up a storm, but it still doesn't make Christianity anything but a religion! Posted: at 18-07-2011 01:44 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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CammyWhite at 18-07-2011 01:46 AM (13 years ago) (f) @hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree? Democrazy - WTF? Posted: at 18-07-2011 01:46 AM (13 years ago) | Gistmaniac | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:30 AM (13 years ago) (m) [@hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree?/quote]
There you go again.Rebut my last submission before draging me into a non issue.This is the problem with you.You asked a question I answered,now instead of you rebutting my position,you are coming up with non issue that hs no concord with what I said last.Address my last submission and I shall reply. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:30 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:32 AM (13 years ago) (m) [@hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree?
Democrazy - WTF? /quote]
Cammywhite Now you understand what i have being saying about this guy. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:32 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:35 AM (13 years ago) (m) What I make of that is that you can write up a storm, but it still doesn't make Christianity anything but a religion!
hmmm... Cammywhite,you have chosen to close your mind to reason. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:35 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:37 AM (13 years ago) (m) [@hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree?/ There you go again.Rebut my last submission before draging me into a non issue.This is the problem with you.You asked a question I answered,now instead of you rebutting my position,you are coming up with non issue that hs no concord with what I said last.Address my last submission and I shall reply. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:37 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:40 AM (13 years ago) (m) [@hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying. I will give you this example so you understand my idea of a discussion. Would you agree with me if I tell you prophet Mohammed was the most important person sent to earth by GOD. He showed this by performing the mist incredible miracle of splitting the moon into two. There is no son of GOD as in Jesus Christ. He was also an human prophet. All this was said by GOD and written in the Quran which has not really changed since GOD spoke the words contained within. Now tell mr. Will you agree?
Democrazy - WTF?
Cammywhite Now you understand what i have being saying about this guy. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:40 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 06:55 AM (13 years ago) (m) @hosbert English is a learnt language of mine it is possible I am not making myself clear for you to comprehend what am saying Just state in clear terms what you meant by this statement. Posted: at 18-07-2011 06:55 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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hosbert at 18-07-2011 07:09 AM (13 years ago) (m) @ Democracy and Cadanre I must say at this juncture that I have resisted your temptations enough.Much as I tried to maintain objectivity in advancing my position in this Forum as well as my espousing of the Gospel of Christ,I have not gone out of my way to insinuate or tacitly insult anyone or his religion.I consider the statement in the first sentence of your last post on my Thread as an affront and I demand an apology.Just for the records,the religion both of you talk about and your Quran is not flawles.A food for thought for you both,though I have no intention of going into that for now,may be in the future.If the reason both of you are in this Forum is to spread hate through the instrumentality of your religion rather than preach peace,then stay away from contributing on my thread.I will appreciate that. Posted: at 18-07-2011 07:09 AM (13 years ago) | Upcoming | |
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